Why?

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Nanda-grama
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Why?

Post by Nanda-grama »

:)
Last edited by Nanda-grama on Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
kamalamala1
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Re: Why?

Post by kamalamala1 »

By the way evrything is based on the idea of Gog in all movments and religion.
If one think that God is a buisnessmen or a King then he is sure that the best is make everybody His servants since bussnessmens and Kings in general doesnt care about persons and individuality they care about how to use people,but think like that it is even offence towards God.
Real father never will like if his child become his servant i am seying real since in this sosiety there are many seek people who try make evrybody including there own childs there servants.
I think it abvious. :D
And this idea that God needs servants is deminishing and destroying
the real Loving image of God totaly.
God is the most dear person for all of us how he can need to make us brailess servants, where is love, and why he should do that?
I had a teory that this planet was controled sometime by demigods and sometime by demons.And religions for last few tousand years
mainly made in demoniac sosietyes.Demigods and demons have different way to aproach God demons mainly based on fear demigods on love .Even the idea of love in demoniac sosites can be based on fear,just remember how and why some people still love stalin and simililar stupid leaders
Prabhupad surely was great person i have no doubths.He did his best for the demoniac sosiety in that time,now the situation is different demigods taking over and the idea of love is becoming more influantive then the idea of fear.

.
Last edited by kamalamala1 on Tue Jun 23, 2009 3:30 am, edited 4 times in total.
kamalamala1
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Re: Why?

Post by kamalamala1 »

:D Dont blame Harshi it is not realy easy to come out from
sectarian dependancy it needs a lot of time and edavoure ,
ecspesialy when he likes to read all kind sectarian coments.
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harsi
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Re: Why?

Post by harsi »

What I may write or find interesting to publish here for others to read is my personal choice. I don't censure the information according to how some of you may do here, namely what may be sectarian or not. By the way people in so called sects are what they are, people like me and you, they have also their connection with God like me and you. God makes no distinction where he may distribute his love and favour like we may do. I like to have a more moderate point of view and not an anti sectarian one like some of you may have. What is the point here some outsider may ask while reading some of our comments. Do this people want to know and understand God and their spiritual nature and relationship better or are they on a trip against some so called sects and their literatures and religious or spiritual interpretation and understanding. What some of us are trying to do here, I have the impression is, that you are trying to imitate Hari but you don't have really his claas, his rethorical talent, his tact and intuitive feeling. The Germans have a saying in this regard: "Schuster bleib bei deinen Leisten" which means something like: "A shoemaker or cobbler should stick to his last." Even if I may find sometimes what he may say very interesting I still allow myself to also have and develop my own opinion and understanding even if it may be sometimes slightly different from that of his or someone of you. Am I not allowed to do that? Am I therefore somehow sectarian? I dont think so. I am just me and nothing more.
kamalamala1
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Re: Why?

Post by kamalamala1 »

I dont understand then why you are alwayes writing the texts wich realy supporting the sectarian angle of vew.
You never realy writing wath you can think alwayes bringing some old
texts wich all we alwready knows very well .For me it is realy not a problem since they sounds funny.
Iam not at all imitating anybody i just writing wath i think and feel.
If you feel that iam imitating so no problem think like that iam not at all feel bad for that.
But you by your quotes imitating the "humble servant of servant of servant of...... servant"boring twisted artifitial concept wich smels
By the way for realy understand God one need to realy come out from any sect and this is not at all easy and from that point of vew it is more helpfull for readers of forum then your quotings..It is my thought ,
You cannot know wath talant i have and not have since you dont know me. And your ability to know anything realy is very doubthfull for me considering your texts.

Yes i understand why you wrote the text above since for sectarian person like you it is very strange if somebody write his own thouths without quoting Acharyas.
.
Armenians have a saying wathever you say to donkey he will say the saim I..AAA
It is like you rtexts wathever we write you are quoting the same
i...aaaa
Last edited by kamalamala1 on Sun Jun 28, 2009 5:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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harsi
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Re: Why?

Post by harsi »

kamalamala1 wrote:I am not imitating anybody I just writing what I think and feel. By the way for realy understand God one need to realy come out from any sect and this is not at all easy and from that point of view it is more helpfull for readers of forum then your stupid quotings.
I accept and appreciate Your opinion and feedback Kamalamalaji alhough I beg to differ sometimes from it and how I see things. I dont accept when someone wants me to put my brain and personal understanding aside when writing here something and comform myself to his or her anti-sectarian, anti-quotation or anti-anything understanding or point of view. You will not stop me from executing my right of free expression the way I like it to be. For that you will have to exclude me from the forum if you still insist on that point. In the journalistic science it belongs to the ABC of any journalist, just ask Hari`s wife Kamala, to quote what someone may have said when writing an article about someone or some subject. That is his legal right in a FREE society which stands in stark contrast to an authoritarian society like Russia still is today according to the opinion of a journalist from Reuters, or a totalitarian one as it was during Communism.

And regarding who may understand God the best I would say there is still a Supreme person or Divinity who can best asses or judge who may really be in such a position... Who are we to judge something like that. We can help someone to understand something in this direction but to say that what we do or think or teach is better, I dont think that we are in the position to argue or judge something like that. "Jeder Kaufmann lobt seine Ware" (Every merchant praises his goods) ~ German proverb. всяк кулик своё болото хвалитIIкауфман (фигурное катание) Are we merchants?

I guess what we really could say is that we are still spiritual searchers on the bright, divers and multicultural way of our's and the supreme's spiritual discovery.
Last edited by harsi on Sun Jun 21, 2009 9:57 pm, edited 11 times in total.
kamalamala1
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Re: Why?

Post by kamalamala1 »

Searchers real ones alwayes questioning everything realy evrything not just following and blindly accepting.
Your quotes just showing oposit most of the time.
But i never said that you should not do wath you like i am realy like
that, wich by the way agitate me to write wath i think.
If you are speaking about journalistic freedom then why you are so agitated when i write my opinion so called anti sectarian ones.
This anti sectarians ideas i think is most important since they are giving real freedom wich i think is the bases of life wath to speak about spirituality.And more then that we was havenly filled with all kind sectarian ideas from ISCON so we doesnt realy need it more wath we need to get our mind from any sects and become our unic selfs without fear and this is not at all easy task.
The whole warld ocupied by sects and this is not a joke itis rela problem people serching Spirituality and falling in that or other sect or religion this is real problem,in my opinion for such searchers it can be real tragedy,for ordinary people i mean not serchers it is maybe ok.
And where is the non sectarian alternative?The realy knew spirituality.

Althought i write so many things against sects but personaly for you i want to say that i personaly very much appreciate Prabhupad
maybe more then sectarians ones since i dont have to and i dont affraid him, and i am free in my life i dont depend on anybody eccept my wellwishers, Gods and Suprime , and dont have any obligation to anybody ,but i can also express myself openly however when i dont agree with him or his metodology i can express without any problem.
I think that this doesnt bother him.He more can be bothered when under his name so many people twisting there lifes.
kamalamala1
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Re: Why?

Post by kamalamala1 »

You maybe felt un comfortable when i wrote that you influenced by sects ,but it is realy wath i felth and it based on all the quotes and texts you wrote.
But in reality it doesnt matter so much .
And this doesnt mean any bad thing.
Nanda-grama
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Why?

Post by Nanda-grama »

For Harsi: if honestly, I don't interest sects very much. And I don't try to imitate Hari, I even can't imagine how I could do it.(when I imagine myself in role of Hari, it looks very funny.) I stumbled over this conversation of Prabhupada and I was surprised very much: he gave wonderful process, but he made the goal of this process practically unattainable(in any case-in consiousness of his disciples). I began to think -it meaned that he didn't interest that his disciples could attain the goal(to contact God), he wanted they would remain in this process eternally. It was very interestingly for me, I wanted to understand why. I wanted that somebody would write in this forum his understanding of it. It is obviously, Harsi, that you don't want to discuss it, you want to discuss what you are free,remarkable,always with your own opinion(which you don't express because some your enigmatic reason) It is OK. But you can begin a new topic: "I am wonderful", why do you write it in this topic "why"?
Kamalamala(thank you), it is interestingly what you wrote. Where do you know from that Prabhupada was the incarnation of Prahlada Maharaj?
About material desires. I know by my experience when I reject some my desires or feelings, I reject some part of myself, I lose myself as unique entity, lose my completion, I can't join with myself and therefore it becomes more hardly to connect with Divine. When I stop to judge some my desires as "material"(that is bad, low and so on), I accept and love myself, I feel peace, I can soberly decide I want to satisfy my desires or not.Then I don't lose myself , I don't suppress myself, I can deal with it. And then my connection with Divine is more full, more saturated, more honest and sincere.
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harsi
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Re: Why?

Post by harsi »

kamalamala1 wrote:Searchers real ones always questioning everything really everything not just following and blindly accepting.


This black and white view of things is in my opinion not very practical especially in a school setting. Imagine you go to school and you want to learn something but you allways question what your teacher is trying to teach you. He may accept such a thing ones or twice and explain to you more deeply what you would like to know, but if you continue in this way more often he or she may say to you sorry Kamalamala it seems to me that you are not serious enough to really learn something from me so please go and give those a posibility to learn something from me who are more interested.

I was explaining ones here that everything has its time and place, even there is a time and place to learn and accept something even blindly. You cannot expect or teach a child in school to put everything into question what the schoolteacher is telling him, because his ability to discriminate between what may be valuable to learn and accept and what may is not so valuable is not developed yet. Therefore I wrote here ones that the realationship between the guru of ancient times and his disciples or pupils of his gurukula makes some sence to me. Since nowadays in school the relationship is somehow the same even if it may have changed slightly at least here in Germany from a pure authoritarian school education how it was until the 1960is here to a more liberal one like it is today. But the so called authority of the schoolteacher is still not put into question or allowed to be put into question by the pupils and what he teaches them also.

I remember when I was in school in the beginning of the 1970is our school in Romania organized a public lecture with the famous Romanian inventor Henri Coandă who invented the first jet aeroplane. The big public hall of the school was full with people and with the pupils of school. What I still remember from his lecture is what he told one friend of mine from school who asked him. How does one become an inventor. To which Coanda replied something like one should first learn the basic foundations of physics and other things in school and than when one knows the basics one should not just accept them as they are but should also try to experiment with that knowledge and try to develop them further. In this way become an inventor. Why not view the relationship between the spiritual teacher and his pupil or disciple the same? Krishna was teaching Arjuna something similar, the spiritual basics, and than told Arjuna to think about what he was teaching or telling him and than do as he likes or sees valuable for him to do.
kamalamala1
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Re: Why?

Post by kamalamala1 »

I realy think taht you are wrong one should question everything ecspesialy teachers.
And good teacher will like such a desciple.
And more then that before accepting teacher one should realy deeply question is the teacher realy knows wath he teaches ,it is very esential since one going to give his life to other person figuraly saying.
Blindly accepting anything is dangarious,.Ecspesialy spiritual teachers. :004
You know your example of child is nopt at all appropriate since the
questions child is asking have complilty practical meaning mainly it is quite different.And bad father will say to his child just stop asking questions just accept wath i am saying.This old fashion not at all appropriate in modern time.

I will sugest to question evrybody Christ Lord Budda Magomet Prabhupad ... evrybody.
Then when one after such deep questioning accept something this will realy be a jewell.Otherwise blindly accepting is useless.
Lord said in Bhagavant Gita one should attentivly look actualy investigate how the teacher speakes walk act and generaly live,who have brain that one can understand wath He mean.
Nanda-grama
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Why?

Post by Nanda-grama »

It is interestingly that when Lord Krishna wanted to impel Arjuna to fight He should tell all Bhagavad-gita before Arjuna agreed with Him. Krishna was God, not simply a spiritual teacher,a and Arjuna loved Him very much but even God should argue His words. :) Even God didn't demand the blind acceptance and obedience from His "disciple"
kamalamala1
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Re: Why?

Post by kamalamala1 »

exactly
kamalamala1
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Re: Why?

Post by kamalamala1 »

About Prabhupad
that he was incarnation of Prahlad Maharaj as i remember i read in Lilamrita ,but Harshi realy the one who can corect and say where it is writen. :D
kamalamala1
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Re: Why?

Post by kamalamala1 »

It is interestingly that when Lord Krishna wanted to impel Arjuna to fight He should tell all Bhagavad-gita before Arjuna agreed with Him. Krishna was God, not simply a spiritual teacher,a and Arjuna loved Him very much but even God should argue His words. Even God didn't demand the blind acceptance and obedience from His "disciple"


You are totaly right
The whole Mahbharata and Srimad Bhagavatam Upanishads based on the questions and answers .And the questions was raised by very mature persons.

This wich you wrote is very interesting and important point,nobody realy noticed it in the sects,you know why since they want to be blind
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